03
Jun
08

DKP quirks

When we formed our guild alliance, we adopted the other guild’s DKP system. It is a very simple system, where we accumulate DKP for boss kills and time spent raiding. Drops have a fixed DKP cost, so there is no bidding. Among those who want the drop, the highest DKP total gets the item and the cost is deducted from their total. We did a DKP reset and started a separate “guild alliance” DKP table for our joint runs.

Unfortunately, the system as it was implemented turned out to work in my guild’s favor. When they did Kara runs that were strictly made up of people from their own guild, they accumulated DKP on their old pre-alliance table. When we did combined guild runs and raids, their DKP added to the guild alliance table.

This didn’t work out well. For many of the people in their guild, their DKP was being split between two tables, while for my guild our DKP was all going on the guild alliance table.

Didja follow that?

When the time came to use DKP for raid drops, my guild members always seemed to have higher totals.
That’s how I wound up with the T4 legs, even though I had picked up the T4 helm and a couple of other items just within the past few weeks.

Also, the way the system was set up you earned MUCH more DKP for Karazhan than in Gruul’s Lair, since there are so many bosses. That made it so you had to raid Karazhan weekly, even if you didn’t need any items from it. If you skipped Karazhan, you would be left in the dust DKP-wise.

The decision was that we would no longer award DKP for Karazhan, since the whole place (except the two dragons) is essentially on farm status anyway.

Now I foresee another problem. If we are only awarding DKP for 25-man content, and we only do Gruul’s Lair right now, DKP totals are not going to go up quickly. Two bosses and one hour of raiding = 7 DKP. The fixed cost for a drop from a raid boss is 30 DKP. So you would have to raid for four weeks to almost make up the DKP you spend on one drop. Is that too much?

Should we increase the DKP awards for 25-man raid bosses? Reduce the DKP cost of the drops? Maybe continue to give DKP for Karazhan but at a reduced rate?

I’d suggest that we go to a completely different system, but they seem attached to the one that they have. It just seems to me that you can’t cut the weekly DKP award to 1/4 of what it was without making some other adjustment to the system.

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3 Responses to “DKP quirks”


  1. 1 David
    June 3, 2008 at 3:51 pm

    Get rid of fixed cost DKP, seriously. Go with a bid system. At the absolute worst if you have silly people who insist on keeping fixed point you must use DKP adjustment to make it a zero sum system over time, either weekly or monthly.

  2. June 4, 2008 at 7:35 am

    Not gaining DKP for Karazhan is, in my opinion, probably the way to go. Karazhan seems a bit disconnected from the loot in the 25-mans.

    The one reason I would think about using DKP is Kara was as a way to motivate the better geared (Karazhan complete) toons to keep going.. but I’ve found that the Badge Loot serves that purpose fairly well.

    As for the rate of gain in Gruul’s, that sounds about right. A fixed-cost kill-focused system needs to be reasonably close to zero-sum, so lets just look at the math.

    From HKM & Gruul, you get 6 tokens and 3 other drops?

    If one drop is wasted – then you have 1 drop for every three people. So, a drop taking three weeks of points makes sense.

    If two or three drops rot, then you get closer to 1 drop for every 4 people. This would be about a drop per month on average.

    Your totals don’t seem all that far off to me, perhaps a bit high (if you regularly have people spend points on everything that drops) – but seeing as how you have been running supply-heavy on DKP for a while, draining some points from the system may not be a bad idea.

    You will certainly have to keep an eye on things. Long term, the system will break if you don’t balance the points coming in and the points going out.. that is one of the costs of this type of system.

  3. June 4, 2008 at 12:34 pm

    Don’t worry about spending more than you earn. You actually have larger problems if you go the other way. Inflation causes a lot of issues.

    Ideally, amount of DKP earned by the raid = amount of DKP spent by the raid.

    As long as you are close to that equation, your DKP system will be fine. If one side of the equation is much larger than the other, then you will have problems.


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